Which type of player can adapt best to a new map?

As a player who started off with scenarios and custom maps and jumped to 3v3's and cw's later, i have an opinion in the matter. First of all clovis was not a scenario player. I was there, every day. Never saw him, not until later. Unleashed was, tunder was, aetius was. Second, its the nature of cw's, 1v1's and 3v3's to to promote a greater understanding of the game, simply because less weight is put into diplomacy (alliances, peace etc) special units and special events. With this in mind i think default map players have a slight and some times bigger advantage over strictly scenario/custom map players who never play default map games.

p.s. When ww2 was at its height we had an autistic weird noob that Unleashed took under his wing and in his team as axis. This guy's name was scezar. That is panteri23 and yeah he started off with scenarios.

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 10:22

Second, its the nature of cw's, 1v1's and 3v3's to to promote a greater understanding of the game, simply because less weight is put into diplomacy (alliances, peace etc) special units and special events. With this in mind i think default map players have a slight and some times bigger advantage over strictly scenario/custom map players who never play default map games.

CWs and 3v3s arent the only things played on default map,FFAs are actually most of games on it.

also most of scenarios are team games anyway (other then GGGs and few other maps) so that point is compleatly invalid.

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 10:22

As a player who started off with scenarios and custom maps and jumped to 3v3's and cw's later, i have an opinion in the matter. First of all clovis was not a scenario player. I was there, every day. Never saw him, not until later. Unleashed was, tunder was, aetius was. Second, its the nature of cw's, 1v1's and 3v3's to to promote a greater understanding of the game, simply because less weight is put into diplomacy (alliances, peace etc) special units and special events. With this in mind i think default map players have a slight and some times bigger advantage over strictly scenario/custom map players who never play default map games.

p.s. When ww2 was at its height we had an autistic weird muslim noob that Unleashed took under his wing and in his team as axis. This guy name was scezar. That is panteri23.

I can agree with this... Default players definitely have a better understanding of basic units and strategies which they can use on any game.

But there's a player called moetez, who made a clan, and cw'ed MK and enigma on a LOTR and GOT etc.. theses guys were r7's,8's,9's and they handed Enigma's ass to them on these maps and looked pretty impressive against MK..pretty sure they beat them on LOTR. But the "default" players simply accused them of cheating.. these maps were not made by them, they just played them allll the time and knew how they worked. Default players rely too heavily on the expansions and tactics that they formulate after playing default hundreds of times......which is the complete opposite of the definition of "adaptability"...

Написао Evic, 23.10.2015 at 10:27

CWs and 3v3s arent the only things played on default map,FFAs are actually most of games on it.

Not only FFA's are the minority, but i also didnt mention them because they are not the kind of maps primarily responsible for default players skill, because they have alot of uncontrolable variables, almost as many as scenarios. Fixed team games, in a fixed map, with fixed units, with 2,4 or 6 players required, make for vast amount of games (you can play 5 cws until you fill a scenario and start it) with controlled variables and force the player to engage in extensive knowledge of game tactics and mechanics.

Написао Evic, 23.10.2015 at 10:27

also most of scenarios are team games anyway (other then GGGs and few other maps) so that point is compleatly invalid.

> almost
> completely

You contradicted yourself there. I have been inactive for quite some time, maybe you are right and most of the scenarios knowdays have fixed teams, but that was not the case when i played.

But the biggest thing of all and the reason why i jumped to 3v3's was the challenge. Games were highly unbalanced, after a point you were bound to play against people way lower than your skill level and as a result you couldnt improve. There couldnt be a greatest satisfaction than to play a good ww2 with balanced teams that lasted long. I would take a game like this over cw's any day. But these games were as rare as a 14 year old british virgin.

Написао Phoenix, 23.10.2015 at 10:37

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 10:22

As a player who started off with scenarios and custom maps and jumped to 3v3's and cw's later, i have an opinion in the matter. First of all clovis was not a scenario player. I was there, every day. Never saw him, not until later. Unleashed was, tunder was, aetius was. Second, its the nature of cw's, 1v1's and 3v3's to to promote a greater understanding of the game, simply because less weight is put into diplomacy (alliances, peace etc) special units and special events. With this in mind i think default map players have a slight and some times bigger advantage over strictly scenario/custom map players who never play default map games.

p.s. When ww2 was at its height we had an autistic weird muslim noob that Unleashed took under his wing and in his team as axis. This guy name was scezar. That is panteri23.

I can agree with this... Default players definitely have a better understanding of basic units and strategies which they can use on any game.

But there's a player called moetez, who made a clan, and cw'ed MK and enigma on a LOTR and GOT etc.. theses guys were r7's,8's,9's and they handed Enigma's ass to them on these maps and looked pretty impressive against MK..pretty sure they beat them on LOTR. But the "default" players simply accused them of cheating.. these maps were not made by them, they just played them allll the time and knew how they worked. Default players rely too heavily on the expansions and tactics that they formulate after playing default hundreds of times......which is the complete opposite of the definition of "adaptability"...

Yes, alot of scenario players are brilliant, i dont deny that and Zone and ferluci's clan, back when they were scenario players was one example. We cwed them in ancient and they raped my Illyrian buddies, heavily i might add. But that was on their map of choice. Anyway, since we are generalising, we have to talk about the percentages and the truth is that games in europe are so fast and competitive, that even the worst dueler or cwer must be fully aware of game mechanics, strategy and economics, otherwise he is gonna get squished aside. Whilst with scenarios you can have great players, but you can have noobs too, or mediocre laid-back players since the settings alow it, i think its about game format and not players themselves. Anyway thats my opinion.

You should have added another option. It doesn't matter what player plays.
It's the person himself. If he have good rational thinking, can process conclusions, and can think forward, he will adapt to any new map and situation.

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 10:46

Написао Phoenix, 23.10.2015 at 10:37

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 10:22

As a player who started off with scenarios and custom maps and jumped to 3v3's and cw's later, i have an opinion in the matter. First of all clovis was not a scenario player. I was there, every day. Never saw him, not until later. Unleashed was, tunder was, aetius was. Second, its the nature of cw's, 1v1's and 3v3's to to promote a greater understanding of the game, simply because less weight is put into diplomacy (alliances, peace etc) special units and special events. With this in mind i think default map players have a slight and some times bigger advantage over strictly scenario/custom map players who never play default map games.

p.s. When ww2 was at its height we had an autistic weird muslim noob that Unleashed took under his wing and in his team as axis. This guy name was scezar. That is panteri23.

I can agree with this... Default players definitely have a better understanding of basic units and strategies which they can use on any game.

But there's a player called moetez, who made a clan, and cw'ed MK and enigma on a LOTR and GOT etc.. theses guys were r7's,8's,9's and they handed Enigma's ass to them on these maps and looked pretty impressive against MK..pretty sure they beat them on LOTR. But the "default" players simply accused them of cheating.. these maps were not made by them, they just played them allll the time and knew how they worked. Default players rely too heavily on the expansions and tactics that they formulate after playing default hundreds of times......which is the complete opposite of the definition of "adaptability"...

Yes, alot of scenario players are brilliant, i dont deny that and Zone and ferluci's clan, back when they were scenario players was one example. We cwed them in ancient and they raped my so called Illyria pro's, heavily i might add. But since we are generalising, we have to talk about the percentages and the truth is that games in europe are so fast and competitive, that even the worst dueler or cwer must be fully aware of game mechanics, strategy and economics, otherwise he is gonna get squished aside. Whilst with scenarios you can have great players, but you can have noobs too, or mediocre laid-back players since the settings alow it, i think its about game format and not players themselves. Anyway thats my opinion.

when was this? Illyria played 9 ancient world cws and won 6 of them. I dont remember us ever even playing a team with zone on it. On the flipside, those clans played us on europe and never won.

Написао Permamuted, 23.10.2015 at 10:58

when was this? Illyria played 9 ancient world cws and won 6 of them. I dont remember us ever even playing a team with zone on it. On the flipside, those clans played us on europe and never won.

i said zone's clan my dear lao, dont remember the players tbh. But i remember that one, because it was the one i played in. And i was dissapointed cause all my allies died fast and left me alone versus three.I remember Skend and Chill and maybe one more, not sure. But i used it as a point, that scenario clans have some brilliant players that sometimes miss out on extending and improving their skills, because they stick to a specific custom map or settings. Thats all. Dont get catty

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 11:05

scenario clans have some brilliant players that sometimes miss out on extending and improving their skills, because they stick to a specific custom map or settings.

WHOA,WHOA,WHOA you dont expect me to just go over this do you?

i think its been made pretty clear so far that defaul map players are the ones that play on 1 map only and oftenly on same settings too.
sceanrios are the ones playing more maps,and ofc its on same settings since scenarios have mostly fixed settings

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 11:05

Dont get catty

Написао Evic, 23.10.2015 at 11:12

WHOA,WHOA,WHOA you dont expect me to just go over this do you?

i think its been made pretty clear so far that defaul map players are the ones that play on 1 map only and oftenly on same settings too.
sceanrios are the ones playing more maps,and ofc its on same settings since scenarios have mostly fixed settings

Oh you dont like my moderate stance? Fine, default players are just better then and for anything further take it up with Laochra and his stats and evidence.

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 11:41

Oh you dont like my moderate stance? Fine, default players are just better then and for anything further take it up with Laochra and his stats and evidence.

you pretty much say scenarios are shit "players that sometimes miss out on extending and improving their skills, because they stick to a specific custom map or settings" and you say it was your moderate stance?

also i pointed out a flaw in your comment for which you failed to argue with me and chose to leave it to laochra to come up with something

Написао Permamuted, 23.10.2015 at 08:20

Terrible thread, the answer is obvious, the funny thing is that no scenario player or custom map player has ever won a tournament on atwar ever. If they were good at adapting they should be able to challenge default world players on their own maps no? Even tournaments on custom maps have been dominated by the default map players. Worse scenario players usually dont have to learn expansion since theyre selecting "sides". It's like looking at a fish out of water when they try to play the default map or literally any map that requires expansion.

The thing is, the default players learn to optimise the hell out of their country/strat combos. The rangeskills, the optimisation, the competition with other players and clans. They take these skills with them to other maps. No i am sorry, there is simply no comparison. You're living in a fantasy world if you believe scenario players are good at adapting.

Also custom map players are better in this regard than scenario players too. Pure scenario players are at the bottom of the foodchain when it comes to an overall knowlege of atwar gameplay.

Let's make a scenario torunment and we'll see. I hate 3v3 because forever, ever and ever are in the same default map with the same Op Turkey and the same expectations. When i made a 3v3 in some custom EU map called EU 1950, or something, can't remember the name now, most of the knowed 3v3 leaved.

Me.




but if i say default map player ill get 100 counter arguments so lets just say im special

edit: any memorizer is the least adaptive whether its default map or scenario

Написао clovis1122, 23.10.2015 at 08:08

Inb4 default players win due to them representing a majority in the forums

i thought so too but i guess life proves you wrong every now and then

Написао Evic, 23.10.2015 at 11:47

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 11:41

Oh you dont like my moderate stance? Fine, default players are just better then and for anything further take it up with Laochra and his stats and evidence.

you pretty much say scenarios are shit "players that sometimes miss out on extending and improving their skills, because they stick to a specific custom map or settings" and you say it was your moderate stance?

also i pointed out a flaw in your comment for which you failed to argue with me and chose to leave it to laochra to come up with something

i used the word "brilliant" yet you equate that to "shit". its obvious to everyone how you lack basic comprehension skills. All your points were adressed, you might have serious mental problems and be potentially retarded. Good day.

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 13:58

i used the word "brilliant" yet you equate that to "shit". its obvious to everyone how you lack basic comprehension skills. All your points were adressed, you have serious mental problems and you are probably retarded. Good day.

read your own fucking comment that started this shit,you basicly said some scenario players are brilliant and that its a shame they are wasting their time on shitty maps (even through you pretty much described EU+ games much more then scenario games in your comment XD)

Написао The Tactician, 23.10.2015 at 12:52

Must agree, Tactician really OP.

Scenario players.

Lock.

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 10:22

First of all clovis was not a scenario player. I was there, every day. Never saw him, not until later. Unleashed was, tunder was, aetius was.

lol khal... I admit I was a very casual player back then, so I don't remember exactly when I started to play WW2 diary... I do remember I was playing it a lot of time before the ROC was made (chinese airforce, basically air units to rape japan infantries. I remember joking around trying to take the ROC capital). I was present during the Mainstein boost, the Canadian-Australian railway, and even the partition of URSS into one in asia and other in europe.

Unleashed germ is bad and I've beat it after beating mainstein many times as urss back then. One he even tried to ignore UK and suicided on leningrad turn 3 against my URSS. I also used to play with Nero (italy), SQUARED (japan, he suck at anything else), learster, panteri, and even Hazardouz (This is Tunder3, I even friendlisted him in a WW2 game). Other players like MoS, Meester, and even played own Tik-Tok a couple of times and Mauzer's China vs my japan. Many other players whose name I don't remember, too. I can vaguely remember you as SIAM in one game though...

Do you still think I wasn't an scenario player before?

Написао Phoenix, 23.10.2015 at 10:11

Edit: Clovis if you can be an "ALL" type of player than what is the point of making this thread? Clearly an "all type" is most adaptable by definition.

Custom map players are "all players" anyway.... meaning a player willing to play any map made by anyone.. scenario's are all custom too so gg I win

The problem is that I only know two players with this characteristic... one of them being myself. Ferlucci is the second one. He plays everything, and can adapt very well to any map in just two or three games.

He adapted first than me to Latin America, and defeat me in Asia 3k after 4-7 games despite that I had already trained my expansions and dedicated time for them.

Fer isn't very good at europe or ancient... but he for sure can adapt fast. I am interested to know where would I find the type of player who can adapt better, in scenarios or custom maps. You guys made it clear that in default map I won't find anyone like this.

Написао Evic, 23.10.2015 at 13:49

Написао clovis1122, 23.10.2015 at 08:08

Inb4 default players win due to them representing a majority in the forums

i thought so too but i guess life proves you wrong every now and then

Agree.

I would probably say scenario players, the ones who play stuff other than ww1 because each new scenario they play is a different set of nations, incomes, units and strategies. I wouldn't say ww1 players because its the same exact """""problem""""" with people who only play default map/3v3, they only base their skill around that and learn through repetition. But, I guess those are the obvious answers but I don't think default players would have a problem adapting to other maps in a matter of days or so just not as quickly as scenario players would.

The most adaptable and we'll rounded players are those not limited by petty preference (hybrids) those who play all the game has to offer and are adept at all forms of conflict.

Написао clovis1122, 23.10.2015 at 16:24

Написао Khal.eesi, 23.10.2015 at 10:22

First of all clovis was not a scenario player. I was there, every day. Never saw him, not until later. Unleashed was, tunder was, aetius was.

lol khal... I admit I was a very casual player back then, so I don't remember exactly when I started to play WW2 diary... I do remember I was playing it a lot of time before the ROC was made (chinese airforce, basically air units to rape japan infantries. I remember joking around trying to take the ROC capital). I was present during the Mainstein boost, the Canadian-Australian railway, and even the partition of URSS into one in asia and other in europe.

Unleashed germ is bad and I've beat it after beating mainstein many times as urss back then. One he even tried to ignore UK and suicided on leningrad turn 3 against my URSS. I also used to play with Nero (italy), SQUARED (japan, he suck at anything else), learster, panteri, and even Hazardouz (This is Tunder3, I even friendlisted him in a WW2 game). Other players like MoS, Meester, and even played own Tik-Tok a couple of times and Mauzer's China vs my japan. Many other players whose name I don't remember, too. I can vaguely remember you as SIAM in one game though...

Do you still think I wasn't an scenario player before?

Написао Phoenix, 23.10.2015 at 10:11

Edit: Clovis if you can be an "ALL" type of player than what is the point of making this thread? Clearly an "all type" is most adaptable by definition.

Custom map players are "all players" anyway.... meaning a player willing to play any map made by anyone.. scenario's are all custom too so gg I win

The problem is that I only know two players with this characteristic... one of them being myself. Ferlucci is the second one. He plays everything, and can adapt very well to any map in just two or three games.

He adapted first than me to Latin America, and defeat me in Asia 3k after 4-7 games despite that I had already trained my expansions and dedicated time for them.

Fer isn't very good at europe or ancient... but he for sure can adapt fast. I am interested to know where would I find the type of player who can adapt better, in scenarios or custom maps. You guys made it clear that in default map I won't find anyone like this.

-you started playing ww2 late. that doesnt make you a scenario player. i didnt even know you until i started 3v3.
-all you ever cared were duels and cws. dont be a hypocrite we all know this as a fact.
- unleashed germany was not bad, in fact he created germany playstyle, shows how you dont know. you prob just faced it near the end when he was either trolling or manstein didnt do his job. another example how unbalanced these scenarios can be.
-you and ferluci are the only two players that can adapt well to any map?..erm ok. I dont know how to respond to this arrogant statement, so i will not. I know a dozen though and i havent even played for months.

Honestly if i were to put my money for the most complete player, it would be hands down Laochra. He might not have a soul (ginger) but he makes up for it in brains. This is a personal opinion though and i am biased.

Not gonna continue posting here though cause you make this kind of trap-threads every 6 months and results in dividing the atwar playerbase, competitives hating you, scenarioplayers loving you and mods putting you in your place ( desu, acquiesce in the past, lao in the present)

Answer: Experienced players adapt the best

CASE SOLVED

well that was easy

Написао clovis1122, 23.10.2015 at 16:24

Unleashed germ is bad and I've beat it after beating mainstein many times as urss back then. One he even tried to ignore UK and suicided on leningrad turn 3 against my URSS.

Написао Khal.eesi, 24.10.2015 at 06:39

- unleashed germany was not bad, in fact he created germany playstyle, shows how you dont know.

>UNLEASHED
>SUICIDE IN RUSSIA

bitch plz, you confused unleashed with me ;P
Unleashed stopped playing a long time ago before Mainstein and Russia got overhauled, there was this thing called "VRIL" who banned me and Unleashed during that time.

To be honest, I don't see scenario players like aw players anyway. They are playing some other game, that is so far from comparing to our loved afterwind. Skill wise, we cant even compare. Why? Did they ever play and win a 3k or 5k World game( with playing against some strongest players in aw) ? Do they even know the feeling of being MoS and taking the opponents whole territory in one turn if you can do it right, or beat a good opponent through sheer skill,will and knowledge ? I think that the reason this game stooped so low (competitive) is because admins gave too much to the scenario players ( because there's more cash to it , its a lot easier, etc). I'm a Beta Trooper so I played this game since it started and I've been on and off depending did I get bored or not and since the begging I ALWAYS SEE THE SAME FACES. Props to some new players that are there now like firefist, swan and etc. But that's not even close how much there's new scenario focused players. If they have something to tell , or talk prove it on custom games BECAUSE THAT'S AW , why should I prove myself on a scenario ? That's like proving myself to some player on Counter Strike 1.6 mod (ski jump, surviive and etc) , the real proving was done on a 5v5 match,and the winner gets the bragging rights. Players that play scenarios don't know anything about AW, they don't know the feeling of tryhard to get r7-8 just so you can play 3v3 , show off your skill and get recruited by some coalition so they can teach you even more knew things about AW and play competitive. For me this scene is dying because you can see everywhere scenario players that get cocky because they can win a scenario , but never played a cw. AW has always been about its competitive scene and when that scene dies ,AW will also die. There are always some scenario players that stand out ,and props to them, but 90% of those players wouldn't have the skill they have if they didn't start playing default games and learned from there.

Mk played over 20 ancient cw's, few on got and some other map, manage to lose only 1 on the ancient map. Default map players for sure can adapt to anything way faster than the scenario players since they have the previous knowledge of handling the income or with strategies

Написао Amorphous, 25.10.2015 at 08:00

To be honest, I don't see scenario players like aw players anyway. They are playing some other game, that is so far from comparing to our loved afterwind. Skill wise, we cant even compare. Why? Did they ever play and win a 3k or 5k World game( with playing against some strongest players in aw) ? Do they even know the feeling of being MoS and taking the opponents whole territory in one turn if you can do it right, or beat a good opponent through sheer skill,will and knowledge ? I think that the reason this game stooped so low (competitive) is because admins gave too much to the scenario players ( because there's more cash to it , its a lot easier, etc). I'm a Beta Trooper so I played this game since it started and I've been on and off depending did I get bored or not and since the begging I ALWAYS SEE THE SAME FACES. Props to some new players that are there now like firefist, swan and etc. But that's not even close how much there's new scenario focused players. If they have something to tell , or talk prove it on custom games BECAUSE THAT'S AW , why should I prove myself on a scenario ? That's like proving myself to some player on Counter Strike 1.6 mod (ski jump, surviive and etc) , the real proving was done on a 5v5 match,and the winner gets the bragging rights. Players that play scenarios don't know anything about AW, they don't know the feeling of tryhard to get r7-8 just so you can play 3v3 , show off your skill and get recruited by some coalition so they can teach you even more knew things about AW and play competitive. For me this scene is dying because you can see everywhere scenario players that get cocky because they can win a scenario , but never played a cw. AW has always been about its competitive scene and when that scene dies ,AW will also die. There are always some scenario players that stand out ,and props to them, but 90% of those players wouldn't have the skill they have if they didn't start playing default games and learned from there.

i can just feel the butthurt in this post.

my favorite part is this "Players that play scenarios don't know anything about AW"

Написао Evic, 25.10.2015 at 09:17

i can just feel the butthurt in this post.

my favorite part is this "Players that play scenarios don't know anything about AW"

AW is about this http://pokit.org/get/?4b3a11f75c292720c67722cafb769128.jpg , sorry but you dont know anything.